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How to stop the cross-voting cartels - a suggested karma-control approach

Dear readers,

I’m sure you have read about how groups of users have formed cross-voting cartels – wherein each user votes blindly for his/her friends’ stories – regardless of whether they have anything within or not. You’ve fumed and fretted but were unable to actually do anything tangible. Relax, you are not alone – read on, you’ve hit the right post.

In the recent past, several seniors have tried to stop this from happening by voicing their anger and frustration against this practice. So far, all that they have is a promise from IndianPad mods that the matter will be looked into and the algorithm will be changed. They also have a whole lot of ill-will from the cartel members too.

While the mods are looking at the change in the algorithm to be made, I felt that maybe we can help by suggesting an approach (see mine below). Feel free to criticize and think outside the box and throw in your ideas into the pot. Hopefully, mods will see the thread and pick out the best ideas for the final solution. Well, enough talk. Let’s see what we’ve got. Let’s get to it now.

Proposed Solution: Let’s assume that there are users with ids u1, u2, u3, u4 and u5 who indulge in cross-voting. They vote for others’ stories also, but they always vote for each others’ posts blindly. For this example, assume that user u1 on average votes for 100 posts from user u2.

Now, I’m not privy to the karma algorithm, but I know that if you have a karma of xxx and vote on a story that has karma yyy, the resulting karma on that post becomes yyy + xxx. I also know that the IP website tracks who has voted for whom how many times and on what posts.

The solution that I am proposing is that the IP website keep track of the number of posts given by a user to another user. In my new approach algorithm, on a given day as you go on voting for a user, the karma boost you give will reduce by 10% each time. Therefore:


1. When u1 votes on the first story of u2, the karma of that story will jump up by: (value of karma of u1 minus 0).
2. When u1 votes on the second story of u2, the karma of the story will jump up by: (value of karma of u1 minus 10%).
3. When u1 votes on the third story of u2, the karma of the story will jump up by: (value of karma of u1 minus 10%) minus 10%)
4. When u1 votes on the fourth story of u2, the karma of the story will jump up by: (value of karma of u1 minus 10%) minus 10%) minus 10%)
5. When u1 votes on the fifth story of u2, the karma of the story will jump up by: (value of karma of u1 minus 10%) minus 10%) minus 10%) minus 10%)

and so on. Finally, a stage will come in when the cross-voting of u1 on u2’s stories will have no effect at all.

Ah – that’s all theory and maths crap. Let’s get some numbers out there.

So, if you are user u1, your karma is 10 and you keep voting from your friend and cartel member u2, then:


1. Your first vote for a story by u2 will add 10 karma points to the story
2. Your next vote for a story by u2 will add 10 – 10% = 9 karma points to the story
3. Your next vote for a story by u2 will add (10 – 10%) – 10% = 9 – 10% = 8.1 karma points to the story
4. Your next vote for a story by u2 will add ((10 – 10%) – 10%) – 10% = 8.1 – 10% = 7.29 karma points to the story
5. Your next vote for a story by u2 will add (((10 – 10%) – 10%) – 10%) – 10% = 7.29 – 10% = 6.561 karma points to the story

and as you go on, your karma contribution to user u2 will go lower and lower till it becomes negligible.

What I liked about this approach is:

1. No one is restricted from voting for stories of their choice
2. Group voting earns you nothing
3. Avoids IP website resource hogging in terms of keeping track of voting patterns

What I did not like about this approach is:

1. There is an additional component of load on the IP website where the site needs to keep track of the number of votes given by a user to other users on a daily basis. But at least this data can be purged at the end of the day.

Let the (constructive) commenting begin.


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Comments
3
chetanw   # chetanw
  Posted 583 days ago. (hide)

No one has anything to add?? C’mon put on your programming/algorithms hat…

4
chetanw   # chetanw
  Posted 583 days ago. (hide)

Wow – that was quick, someone already voted down my comment above.

5
TollywoodBollywood   # TollywoodBollywood
  Posted 583 days ago. (hide)

My god you have done a lot of work…let me get to this after the match…

3
gvk   # gvk
  Posted 583 days ago. (hide)

Good Work chetanw

4
indianboy   # indianboy
  Posted 583 days ago. (hide)

Just ban those cartel members’ Celebrity sites, Picture Stories for a few weeks and all the dirt will weed out.

3
chetanw   # chetanw
  Posted 583 days ago. (hide)

@indianboy,

Some of us might like to do that – but I don’t think the mods will agree. I also think that’s not a completely fair solution.

The point is that only the mod can access the IP Database to see who has voted how many times for whom in a given period. If that data were to be published, it would be easy to track down who is really a member of the cross-voting group.

1
chetanw   # chetanw
  Posted 583 days ago. (hide)

I wonder if IndianPad is listening to this??

6
indianpad   # indianpad
  Posted 583 days ago. (hide)

chetanw – This is good! I like the core idea of reducing the reward for cross-voting. I also like the idea to publish who has voted for whom. Right now there is a lot of fighting on the site but people have to hunt within the profile to get any proof. Such a system may help the veteran users in pin-pointing the culprits.

However, this may impact users who post a lot of stories in a day as they will not be able to get votes from all users. This would still allow users to cross-vote for each other if they post 4-5 stories in a day.

I will go ahead and play with various scenarios to see how we can use this…

3
rohanpinto   # rohanpinto
  Posted 583 days ago. (hide)

check that out !! chetooo u must be beaming in pride right now.. cooll buddy… your hard work has paid off !!!

2
chetanw   # chetanw
  Posted 582 days ago. (hide)

@indianpad,

Just thinking aloud here:

However, this may impact users who post a lot of stories in a day as they will not be able to get votes from all users.

Hmm, you’re right there. If someone keeps voting for stories posted by one user in a day, it will affect them. For example, if user u1 votes for every story by user spencer911 in a given day, soon, the vote by u1 won’t add any karma to spencer911’s posts. However, I don’t believe that would necessarily be a bad thing.

This would still allow users to cross-vote for each other if they post 4-5 stories in a day.

True. However, with 4-5 stories a day, it will slow down cross-voting dramatically. If you want to go all the way, you could consider the reduction percentage to be made specific to the user. For example, if user u1 and u2 consistently vote for each other’s stories, their karma boost will drop 25%, each time they cross-vote. But if user u1 rarely votes for u3, then the karma boost will drop by only 10%.

The above approach puts a higher load on the site though.

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